Regenerative Ag Stories on the Grazing Grass Podcast

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0:00:00 - Cal
Welcome to the Grazing Grass Podcast, Episode 136.

0:00:05 - Ashlynn
You just have to try and if you really are stuck, reach out. Ask for help.

0:00:11 - Cal
You're listening to the Grazing Grass Podcast, sharing information and stories of grass-based livestock production utilizing regenerative practices. I'm your host, Cal Hartage. You're growing more than grass. You're growing a healthier ecosystem to help your cattle thrive in their environment. You're growing your livelihood by increasing your carrying capacity and reducing your operating costs. You're growing stronger communities and a legacy to last generations. Growing stronger communities and a legacy to last generations. The grazing management decisions you make today impact everything from the soil beneath your feet to the community all around you. That's why the Noble Research Institute created their Essentials of Regenitive Grazing course to teach ranchers like you easy to follow techniques to quickly assess your forage, production and infrastructure capacity in order to begin grazing more efficiently. Together, they can help you grow not only a healthier operation, but a legacy that lasts. Learn more on their website at nobleorg slash grazing. It's n-o-b-l-e dot org. Forward slash grazing. Ashlyn, we want to welcome you to the Grazing Grass podcast. We're excited you're here today.

0:01:47 - Ashlynn
Thanks for having me, Kyle. I'll be honest, I couldn't sleep. I was so excited to do this, so I can't wait to see what we get into.

0:01:54 - Cal
Oh wonderful, it's a casual conversation, so no reason to be nervous. Some people come on, they're nervous. But to get started, ashlyn, tell us a little bit about yourself and your operation.

0:02:07 - Ashlynn
So, like you said, my name is Ashlyn. I am from Southeast Iowa, but actually I started my cattle experience in Western Iowa that's where my family is at, and after I got through college I met my husband and we moved back to his home area, which is right north of Fairfield Iowa, and that is currently where we are running our commercial Red Angus herd with his grandfather, and then we're also working on expanding it into possible other breeds.

0:02:36 - Cal
Oh, yes, exciting First. Just as a kid did you grow up in ag.

0:02:43 - Ashlynn
Oh yes, I was the kid that as soon as I was old enough to be in 4-H, I was hounding my parents to have an animal of some kind. My dad actually grew up showing cattle at the county fair and I remember him telling me all the stories of what they did and what it was like. I knew that's what I wanted to go into, so yes 4-H was my avenue and I knew that.

So I got my first calf when I was a fourth grader and I was sold. I was hooked and that's what started my passion. I was very fortunate that my parents supported that passion really well. So I grew up traveling the country during the summer and going to different national shows in the fall. I was in the Salir breed, which is a smaller breed, but I had a lot of opportunity there.

So that's where my start was actually in a Salier breed and doing national shows, as well as exploring our own seed stock stuff. Again, my parents were so supportive and anything I wanted to try with cattle they were like all right, keep with the work and we'll do it.

0:03:44 - Cal
Oh, very good, Now going through school. In FFA I showed at our local show and our county show and I showed dairy cattle.

0:03:53 - Ashlynn
Oh, very cool, which means I had to do some trimming.

0:03:56 - Cal
I had to wash them. I didn't have to ball the tail up, I just had to clean it. I'd see those people showing steers and heifers or the sheep people. I felt I was like I'm never showing either of those. They put so much work into their animals, my dairy animals. I didn't work with them enough. They could lead, but not great, and I washed them, do a little bit of trimming and we were good to go.

0:04:24 - Ashlynn
Hey, whatever works, I loved washing the animals. I love the hair care the whole nine yards. So it was fun because, as when you show animals, they become your best friend. So I got to travel with all my best friends we went to. I think by the time we were done we had been to 13 different states and practically every time I had my best friend whatever calf it was for the year with me Plus my family.

0:04:49 - Cal
Oh, yes, that is wonderful and that's a way so many people get involved in ag and what they do. Solares are an interesting breed. I remember hearing about them and reading about them, but I don't know, outside of seeing them at a show, that I've ever seen one out in the wild. I guarantee you have and you. I don't know, outside of seeing them at a show, that I've ever seen one out in the wild or on a farm.

0:05:08 - Ashlynn
I guarantee you have and you just didn't know it and that may be the case. Yeah, we look like in the herd just out of new pasture. You would think we're an Angus or a Lenny just because of our frame size and then like the muscling and everything. But it really comes down to a lot more of the like maternal traits. So the mothering, the calving ease, the calf vigor, milk quality, things like that are what we really promote as the Sleer breed and we are a perfect breed to do crossbreeding because we transfer into any breed and give those maternal characteristics to them.

0:05:42 - Cal
So I guarantee you've seen one, you just didn't realize it. Oh, I probably have and, to be honest, I lay men about this all the time. All the breeds look so much alike now. I just don't like that at all.

0:05:55 - Ashlynn
Hence is why we are with red Angus, so we stand out a little bit more. We're not black like the rest of them. Nothing wrong with that.

0:06:02 - Cal
Oh yes.

0:06:02 - Ashlynn
But color is fun.

0:06:03 - Cal
Right Color is fun. Yeah, well, we have red cattle, we also have some black ones, but we have mainly red cattle for my dad's herd and for my herd I have red cattle and then I have spotted cattle because I have some Corrientes and I love the coloration. I love the color genetics, but what I don't love is if they go through a cell ring. But the other parts I love.

0:06:28 - Ashlynn
And that's just one minor part we don't like we can get past that, it's okay.

0:06:32 - Cal
Right. As long as I can afford it, I can get past that.

0:06:35 - Ashlynn
Exactly Everything else is great.

0:06:38 - Cal
So you were started showing in 4-H, showed over the country, 13 different states, and then you said you went to college. Did you go to college for ag?

0:06:49 - Ashlynn
I did. But I'll be honest, my first semester I went to community college first because I wasn't quite for sure what university I wanted to go to, and in that first semester I was like I'm just going to take very basic classes. I know I want to go into ag, but maybe there's something else. Yeah, first month at a college I knew that was wrong. I was missing my classes about ag. I was missing me with the cows.

So, yeah, I went to college for first ag business and then, after my community college, I went on to get my bachelor's in ag science and then a year ago, I actually finished my master's in ag education, leadership and communications. So, on top of cow, I also love school.

0:07:30 - Cal
I like it a lot you know, I have a problem with school as well. If I could no, not. If I could, because I could do it, but I don't want to pay for it I'd be in school right now. I, I have my education degrees, I, I, yeah, I love learning in addition to my animal science degree. So that's crazy.

0:07:50 - Ashlynn
Yeah, there's just always something new?

0:07:53 - Cal
Oh yeah, I love so. My wife just a few years ago she had not. She had gone to community college but hadn't finished her degree. And then she went ahead and finished her degree and she's in education, teaching first grade, and I told her we've got to pick something to learn now, because we are not on a structured plan, so we spend too much time in the evening not doing I hate to say, not doing anything productive. We're getting quality of time together, we're spending time together and that's very important, but there was a part of the time I was working on my doctorate and she was working on her bachelor's, and so the evening was us being quiet and doing our own work, but we were in the same room. But I feel like we don't have that structured plan for learning anymore and she tells me I'm crazy.

0:08:45 - Ashlynn
So that's okay, I would be that person in my relationship. Also, my husband started his master's degree year after me, so yeah, there was that timeframe in there. We were both studying and like we could have that conversation because we were learning the same things different universities, but learning the same things and now it's not there. He doesn't want to go back to school, though he was like my master's is done, I don't want to do anymore. He's an ag teacher.

But he's like nope, I'm good. So that's where, honestly, he is the guy that does most of the researching for grazing. That's like his niche, and then we work together on figuring out how to actually implement that. So I guess, ironically, the grazing part has now become our school and that's what we spend our time on.

0:09:30 - Cal
Oh, yes, yeah, which is great. Yeah, now, before we talk more about what you're doing now, what university did you go to for your bachelor's and master's?

0:09:43 - Ashlynn
I went to Northwest Missouri State Go Bearcats for my bachelor's and then my master's. I got at Mizzou. I did an internship with the Missouri Beaconry Council after I graduated my bachelor's and I fell in love with Columbia and I fell in love with Mizzou and I was sold, so I knew exactly that's where I wanted my master's from.

0:09:59 - Cal
Oh, yes, yeah. Well, I have to say I'm a little disappointed by that answer. I thought sure we were going to get an Iowa State in there. Mizzou, you know, they left the Big 12 and went to the SEC and that causes a problem for a football fan who's a fan of Oklahoma State. So Iowa State. We feel we like Iowa State pretty good as OSU fans if we take 2011 out, when they really messed up our national championship chances. So, anyway, no one cares about that, so we'll move on.

0:10:33 - Ashlynn
But I thought that was interesting. My husband went to Iowa State for his bachelor's and master's, so there is a cyclone.

0:10:41 - Cal
Oh, ok, well, very good. Very good, you did mention you guys are in Eastern Iowa now. Is that fairly close to Missouri, where you're located?

0:10:52 - Ashlynn
We're roughly an hour 10 minutes from the Missouri border, so close yeah, Honestly. We're only an hour and a half from the Illinois border also, so we're like in that nice little middle oh yeah. And then we're an hour and a half from Des Moines, so literally perfect little triangle.

0:11:08 - Cal
Oh yeah, very good. Yes, I'm up in the corner of Oklahoma, so I'm like 40 minutes from Kansas, 50 minutes from Missouri, probably. Well, if I could go in a straight line it'd be shorter, but probably an hour from Arkansas. There's a lake between Arkansas and us that you got to go around, so that makes it a little bit longer.

0:11:29 - Ashlynn
That is fair.

0:11:32 - Cal
So you ended up going to your husband's family, his grandparents' farm, I think.

0:11:39 - Ashlynn
The generation between and then my husband would be his mom and her siblings, and they all were entrepreneurs, honestly. So mine is my mother-in-law. She's a elementary teacher. Love her for it. But yeah, all them were entrepreneurs. So they took different paths and the farm was definitely a stepping stone and helped them, but it wasn't necessarily the end all. So there was a gap in there, actually, where my grandfather-in-law brought in a manager to help take care of because my grandfather also is a very large sow farmer.

Like huge operation and they did row crop and then they started cattle. So they needed an additional person to help run stuff. So, yeah, they had a farm manager come in and he's been around for the last 15 years, give or take. And actually in the last year and a half they decided they were going to split row crops, pigs and cattle. So row crop is being cash rented by another local farmer super nice guy and then the ranch manager. He is now running just the sow operation. So that gave room for my husband and I to come in and take over the cows.

0:12:50 - Cal
So that's the balance of everything and then grandpa overseas oh, yeah, yeah, which is a great opportunity for you all, because getting started in ag is not always the cheapest thing it.

0:13:04 - Ashlynn
It's not. We have a lot of friends that we have two of them that they are going to inherit super large row crop operation. But then we have another friend and his wife that they aren't going to really hear anything. So they are starting to ground zero cattle row crops full nine yards.

And the amount of infrastructure and capital they have to take is just crazy. It's scary also because of interest rates and everything, but it's what they have to do if they want to get started. So we're very fortunate for where we're at that grandpa left a spot for us to come back to.

0:13:36 - Cal
Oh, yeah, yeah, well, and we see that so often. Yeah, with my grandparents' farm they had four kids and two of them are interested in cattle their son who helps them and does cattle there, and then my mom and dad. My mom was the other sibling and mom and dad do cattle and I'm here with my parents helping them. But then I've got two siblings who, as soon as they could leave the dairy, they took off running and they never looked back. Now for me, I went to college and I worked on the dairy and then came home and dairy until we sold out. So obviously you know right off I'm not the smartest of the three, but I'm right here where I want to be.

0:14:21 - Ashlynn
And that's the big thing is we feel at home, being with the herd. That's why we separate out because it's not easy doing a farm family, farm transition, but it's worth it. We know what it's worth it yeah, has there been any?

0:14:37 - Cal
I I'm sure there's been some growing pains. Are you all coming in to establish operation? Is there any you all want to share to help others?

0:14:46 - Ashlynn
So the biggest thing we've learned through this entire process is communication and being very forward thinking. Obviously there's lots of minds involved and lots of thoughts and it got. Really, I'll be honest, I got twisted for a little bit in there. So many different ideas are flowing and we hadn't built a strong communication channel yet and it got to the point where we would show up to the farm and X, y, z job would be done and we're like hold up, we didn't know that was happening, we didn't know that was a thing. So yeah, we learned early on that we have to be very forward and say, okay, here's what we want to do and why, and then leaving it as an open-ended conversation, not a yes, no, it's a. Let's discuss it and figure out what's going to be best for everybody involved.

We're not the only ones that are going to benefit from this. We have to make sure our grandpa and everyone else is taken into consideration. So, definitely, open communication channel is huge and, honestly, don't take things personal. It's never attack on you. It's somebody else's emotions coming through and they just farm. Transitions aren't easy and they're going to let those emotions fly and you just got to take it with a grain of salt and know, at the end of the day, you're still family. You've got to make it work if you want the farm to succeed. That's just on our side.

0:15:59 - Cal
Those two pieces are tremendous. I've said on the podcast before communication you talk to anyone in any industry. You worked a little while in education. I'm sure communication wasn't as good as it needed to be there. Communication is always difficult, so it's always better to over-communicate than under-communicate.

0:16:20 - Ashlynn
Amen, 100% agree with that. Yes.

0:16:23 - Cal
Yeah, then the other. Not taking it personally. You're all working towards the same goal and that's important to remember. We're all working towards the same goal. It wasn't. It's not a personal disagreement or attack or anything. It's just their view. Their perception of the problem or where you should go is different. And as long as you're working towards that end goal, usually you can get there. But if you start worrying about these other things, you run into some problems. So you all came home to the farm and we talked a little bit about that transition. But what did the when you all got there? How? What did the farm look like?

0:17:06 - Ashlynn
So the farm was in a, like we said, a state of transition. So we actually not me, grandpa and the farm manager had decided to cut the stocking rate because of the change in management. There was no way that they could run the number of cattle they did, and do it in a successful manner and, honestly, just because of how large everything was, there was different areas of the farm that had gotten neglected. So when my husband and I came in there's a lot of good ideas and good purpose not everything got executed the way it should. So we had a lot of fence rows, fence, fence lines that had to get fixed. The pastures, honestly, had been overgrazed in some spots, to where the amount of diversity was none Like.

The grass was literally a lot. We had a conservation manager from the local NRCS come out and he evaluated our land and everything and he told us that the only grass we had growing at that time was Kentucky bluegrass. I'm like great, I just that's all I have right now.

0:18:13 - Cal
So, that.

0:18:14 - Ashlynn
And thistles holy moly, the thistles were awful. So right away my husband and I knew we, if we want this to succeed and produce the best cattle we could, we needed to change something. And it wasn't feed, because there's plenty of hay, we could get corn stalks, we could get grain Like. That wasn't what was lacking. What was lacking was a pasture that could support our cattle in the way we wanted it to. So, honestly, when we came back, the first thing we had to do was reevaluate how the pastures were managed if we wanted to even make it through the summer.

0:18:49 - Cal
When y'all were looking at your pastures and you've got Kentucky bluegrass some thistles out there that's not providing you much value. What was your process to figure out what your next step should be?

0:19:01 - Ashlynn
We were honestly lost because I lucked out where I grew up we never really had any grass management issues. My husband, when he was living on the farm, there wasn't any grass management issues. So when we came back it was, oh man, where do we start? So we actually have a friend that works in the NRCS office and just talking with her she's like we just need to call out our grazing management, conservation management specialist and have him look at what you have and give you some ideas.

So that's actually where we got started. We brought in a specialist and showed him around our one of our main paddocks where we figured we do most of our grazing, and just said okay, what can we do? We know there's erosion issues, we know there's lack of diversity out here. We know there's a weed problem. What do we need to do? And he gave us a list of different ideas and said you can try different type of paddock management, you could. We were at the point where we couldn't really seed anything. He's like you can also spray for your thistles. So he gave us a lot of ideas and we let that kind of digest a little bit. My husband started to dig through Iowa State's extension information on grazing and then we pieced together a plan Okay, the first thing we have to do is at least put in paddocks, Because at that point the pasture had really just been continuously grazed and the cows had a free-for-all. Okay, that's not going to help us one bit.

So we picked a sacrifice area where we decided no matter what happens, this is gonna be the piece of area that looks the worst and we just have to do it.

So we have a place to set the cows when we're trying to give those other areas of break. So we started there and then we lucked out. There actually was quite a bit of polywire and fence posts for us. So we just started putting out fence posts and polywire where the grass was good and then, after the cows and berries sat down, then we started to go back to the other areas that the grass had started to come back.

There was definitely some spots where my favorite tractor and machinery equipment was the 7830 and the batwing. I did a lot of batwing in the first month and a half because we found a lot of our pasture hadn't been grazed for a while so that wasn't a dead state, okay, it had been to the reproductive point. It wasn't vegetative anymore. The cows didn't like the taste of it. So yeah, I did a lot of batwing to try and get the grass back to that lush green for them.

0:21:33 - Cal
Oh yeah.

0:21:34 - Ashlynn
And we did that, like I said, the first month. But then we got into breeding season and we needed to get the bulls out with the cows and things got a were complicated. So we just split the herd in half and sent the bull and cows to one paddock and then the other set to a completely different pasture to really reduce the workload on our grass. And just in the two months of us doing that and going through the breeding season, it was phenomenal. Granted, I was had an amazing rain this year. We're out of our drought, but just that break, holy moly. We went out there and we started seeing fescue come back. We have bro.

We have red clover, white clover. On a couple of our spots have the birch tree foil. I can never say that, right, but it's the yellow flower.

0:22:22 - Cal
Neither can I, so you're good.

0:22:23 - Ashlynn
Perfect, yeah. So, like all, I was coming back. I'm like holy cow, okay, this is working. So, after seeing that, we went back and we had spent a lot of time fixing fence lines and that, so we went back to the fence lines that we trusted the most and we really started sectioning out. Okay, here's a section of grass. We're going to keep cows on here until it gets too short and then we're going to move them. And for us, too short really came down to being when we could see the cow's hooves, when we were seeing the cow hoof. We need to move, because I don't want to stress this grass any further than it was previously.

So we might have been a little more lenient with when we pulled them off and kind of grazed, probably a little harder. But since we were just trying to really get the ground to grow the grass again, we're like we're going to be very simple, very easy on this grass.

0:23:18 - Cal
Well, just getting started on grass management and starting with doing some rotational grazing. It's easy to get locked into analysis, paralysis and too many different ways. What should I do? Should I not do that? Should I? Don't Just go start and I say that and there's so much more to that, but just take an easy approach, whatever that may be, for you all. If we can see the hoofs, we need to move them. If, whatever that is, make it easy on you at the beginning. You, as you reflect and grow, you'll get better at grass management. But but the important thing is to get started, because it's not real easy to get started because, like you you mentioned, youall had to decide on a sacrifice area because if you are set stock and overgrazing areas, you don't have somewhere to put them. You've just got to make a piece and put them there and then start working on the other.

Yeah it doesn't change overnight, but you can see results fairly quickly if you get started.

0:24:26 - Ashlynn
Correct. I'll be honest. There is some times where we just did the throw it at the wall and see if it sticks method and if it didn't.

We are very fortunate that our cattle are well-trained. I spent a lot of time out there petting them. If you've seen on my social media, I am with them a lot, so they go wherever we want them to and that made it a lot easier with. Our cattle were trained to us and moving with us and didn't fight. They enjoy being around us. So I wanted to move them three or four times in a day Cause, like us staff, that fence line isn't good. They're in, get out, or oh, there's really not that much grass here. They didn't fight us, they just went with it and were just happy to be around us.

So that helped a lot, too is having the cattle trained to work with us, not against us.

0:25:13 - Cal
You all started moving them. Breeding season hit and you were able to give it sounds like and correct me if I'm wrong you were able to give some land a longer rest than what you had planned because of breeding season and then you really saw that seed bank come alive. And all these species come out.

0:25:31 - Ashlynn
That is exactly correct. Breeding season was the perfect. It hit at the perfect moment for us because yes we were able to not use paddocks where the fence was really bad. It gave us time to fix our fence line. It also gave us time to watch honestly what our cows wanted to graze and what they wouldn't graze.

0:25:56 - Cal
Oh yes.

0:25:56 - Ashlynn
Our girls are picky, I'll be honest, and they would go back to the same spot over and over, even if they had more grass in the same paddock, just a different location, because we're assuming it was their learned behavior. Before it was like everything was over grazed. So they found a sweet spot, they stayed there.

So for us, we were able to also learn their behaviors and say okay oh, yeah, we have to make them move, or we have to put up an additional paddock just to make them mob graze a certain area so they realize oh, there's food here, I can eat here and not just keep going back to the same spot, creating an overgrazed location and causing more issue. So yeah, breeding scene was excellent for us. In that way, we also luck out that the bulls have their own pasture, they stay in, so we knew if worse came to worse. We had another pasture that we can move them to. That was a nice thing.

We have enough pasture land, we can move cattle and we weren't stuck to one spot.

0:27:02 - Cal
Very good With doing that in your paddocks. Was your water situation such that you were able to get them to water easily, or do you all have to do anything to improve your water infrastructure?

0:27:16 - Ashlynn
So that's the nice thing of Southeast Iowa. For the most part, we have a decent amount of waterways around here, whether it be ponds, lakes, creeks, you name it. So most of our areas have a natural water source of some kind. But on the flip side. Grandpa and the previous farm manager did an excellent job of adding in water sources where it made sense, so we have a couple areas that have the nice cobat waters.

We have a few gravity fed waters, so water is never an issue, thankfully, because that additional infrastructure has been put in place. But if they ever went out, we'd have to worry because there were natural water sources located in the paddock for the cattle. And that's just a geographic thing, so right there.

0:28:03 - Cal
Yeah, unfair advantage you have Correct, not really unfair, but advantage you have is your source of water. What your husband's grandparents have done, plus all the natural water available, makes that water piece. That's usually a little bit of an issue for a lot of people. Not be such a big concern for you, so very good. Lot of people not be such a big concern for you, so very good. Now you started moving them. How often are you moving cows now? What are your rules for your grass management? Are you still following that? If you can see their hoof, it's time to move. Are you doing anything differently now?

0:28:39 - Ashlynn
so we are still following the hoof method, but I've also talked to a couple friends that also are trying to build in more rotational grazing and the easiest advice I've heard is the third drool, so we can monitor, and we let them eat a third, trample a third and then we try to leave that third, and sometimes it's a little more than a third, and that's fine, because again, we want to keep that grass growing because we started this, I would say honestly, beginning of the summer. So we really started to do rotational grazing and since then the amount of thistles have disappeared. Yes, we did some spraying all the really nasty spots but, like the rocky areas where we couldn't get to just by pushing more grass growth, the grass has taken over some of those weed spots.

So seeing that was like, okay, we're on the right track, we're making it work. We got to make sure we keep giving the grass its best opportunity possible and there was, honestly, times where we probably couldn't move the calves, but they were doing so well in a paddock and the paddock was doing good. We didn't want to disrupt that cycle, so to keep the other paddocks growing. I would just go battling it and keep it in that vegetative growth. Push the seeds heads into the ground with the tractor tires.

Not perfect, but it worked and we would do that enough to keep it going. We did get to a point where some of the paddocks were just rock stars and growing beyond what we could, and we were able to bale them for hay this year, which was also fantastic because we have a friend.

She is a dairy nutritionist and has access to feed samples, so she came and tested our grass bales and it helped us see what our nutritional value was on those paddocks. So then we knew, when we put the cows out there, what they were receiving. Also gave us a good idea of like. Maybe we need to start a fertilizer program for our soil, whether it's on the hog manure nearby, or we need to give co-op. It gave us that additional knowledge piece to take care of the grass better.

0:30:43 - Cal
Oh, yeah, yeah, and I would assume that hog manure, the availability of that, would be really nice. We had chicken houses for a little while and I tell people that chicken litter or barter litter could make rocks grow grass. We put it on, it makes a tremendous difference and really helped the land here.

0:31:07 - Ashlynn
Okay, Chicken litter is something that here in Iowa people are starting to research on certain fields. Just because I was one of the number one egg producers, so we have a lot of chickens here. It's just figuring out how to use that manure and, yeah, there's a lot of research because they're finding out it is a good nutrition source for soil.

0:31:22 - Cal
Oh yeah, there's some things you have to be careful about, but wow, it's amazing what it can do to land or how it can help in the process Now with your cattle. You talk about moving paddocks, are you? And you'd also mentioned you all had some polywire and stuff, so I assume you're using some electric fence in addition to your permanent pastures to subdivide those down.

0:31:46 - Ashlynn
Correct. So a lot of our fencing, I would say the external line, so the outside is permanent, and then we have in all the paddocks at least one or two other permanent sections. So our big pastures are split into about three chunks, and then we use poly wire to break it down even further from there, because they're also not perfect squares or perfect triangles, so we use that poly wire. Correct. Why would it be perfect? So yeah, we use the poly wire to help build a paddock.

That makes sense Because in two, like, we had calves out there and we had some calves that took off and were eating grass fantastic and others that weren't, so that kind of changed how much area we gave them, based on what the calves were eating. Also, and there would be times when, or recently, we went to wean calves and we started them on creek feed again to try to take some of that stress off everybody, off everybody. And that meant we really had to adapt how the paddocks set up, because we only have one spot in the pasture that the current feeder would sit level and not get sunken in.

So of course, that changed the paddocks and yeah, so the polywire helped us be more flexible, based upon what the cattle were needing at that time did you have?

0:33:00 - Cal
you had any trouble with your cattle on the polywire or anything? You all learned like, oh, we shouldn't do this, we got to do this with poly wire.

0:33:09 - Ashlynn
Oh yeah, we've had some learning curves with it, to say the least we have. We call her big mama. She is just this huge semi-tall cow Sweetest thing ever. But she's a fence pusher and if she finds a weak spot, oh man. And that's the biggest thing we learned was our hot wire. We had to run it really hot for a while. We had to retrain her and all of her followers that we respect the poly wire, do not cross the poly wire, it is not going to end well for you. So we had to to go. We actually lucked out when qc supply over in washington isn't too far from us, so we took our solar panel electric fencers over to them and had them, test them and replace some of the parts that weren't working quite as well so we could up our voltage and that really helped a lot. And now that was midsummer. So now the girls, they respect the polywire way more because they learned it's hot.

Yeah, that was our biggest challenge was training them to respect that poly wire Because it doesn't look like their normal fence. It's not barbed wire or woven wire, it was just a piece of string so they had to learn that was hot.

0:34:18 - Cal
Oh yeah, Did you ever test your fence to see how many volts it was putting out? Yep.

0:34:24 - Ashlynn
Every time we would move them and put it back up, we would test, and we've gone everywhere from when the solar power, solar panel, electric fence wasn't working quite as well. We were on like seven volts. My husband can tell you if it's like a thousand hundred, whatever, but seven was the number they gave us and now we're all 11. And when we hit that 11 the girls learned way faster like don't cross oh yeah so now we ride the line of like nine, 9 000 volts where we I think it's 9 000 volts is where we like to sit typically yeah, I think I suspect you're correct there.

0:35:00 - Cal
Yeah, well, very good, I know getting started with polywire can sometimes be a little headache. We purchased a few cows this spring and they are fence pushers. They were trained to get out of their pastures and they have caused us headaches. In fact, if they don't straighten their act up pretty shortly, they're going to find a new pasture, find a new pasture. They're on a very short list right now. Yeah, and if we knew they were going to be fence pushers we wouldn't have purchased them. But we thought there was opportunity there, we thought they'd work out good, and they've been headaches for me. In fact. Just the other night, dad calls me and says hey, you got a cow out on the hill. So I go up there and of course it's one of those and then while I'm sitting there, we have a ATV or a UTV cattle guard there. I watched two other of them, two more of them from this set walk the cattle guard. So I had to put them in a different posture.

0:35:56 - Ashlynn
You have talented cows, is what you mean?

0:35:58 - Cal
Yes, well that's not the word I was using, but yes, they're talented, fair enough.

0:36:04 - Ashlynn
Yeah, we can't say what we actually call them in that moment.

0:36:08 - Cal
Right. Yes, so I'm not very pleased with those cows. They got to straighten up their act pretty soon. I don't blame you, I support that. Let's shift gears just a little bit. We'll continue talking about your cows. But your grandfather had red Angus, which I think is another very unfair advantage. You might even say Red Angus are a nice breed for grazing and they've really focused on the maternal qualities in red Angus. So I think that's a huge advantage. Coming in and doing a changeover to grazing and with that, with the different breeds. There's more variation within a breed than between breeds, but some just seem to work out a little bit better than others.

0:36:52 - Ashlynn
And you are right, we. I say we have a Red Angus herd but reality is the Red Angus commercial herd. So our bulls we run are pure Red Angus, and then our cows. So before we came in grandpa and the range manager, they were trying different things to see what would stick for breed. So we, had everything from Scimital Hereford. Apparently some Lemmy cross in there, but of the cows we kept back.

Most of them really ride that red Angus or Scimital cross and my favorite cow out there. She is a semi cross and I love her pieces but I will be honest, she isn't as good as a grazer compared to some of our red angus looking mamas. They just eat and eat, and their calves were monsters this year and we were very impressed with how they performed oh yeah, we will keep our scimitar girls don't get me wrong.

But yeah, you could see that difference in some of those breed characteristics oh yes, I'm sure you can now.

You had mentioned, or I think you mentioned earlier you are considering some other breeds as well I'm still a salir girl at heart, so I would like if the salirs back to southeast iowa. But even then my husband and I agree, though is very big on heterosis and the benefits that come from crossbreeding. So, like I said, we have a lot of those mamas that show a lot of red angus characteristics and we have that pure red red angus bull, which is is great. We love them.

But as we expand and grow the herd. We want to try and bring in another breed that will complement what we have already, and then just help us go that next step above. So, yeah, we're in the market. Not quite for sure what market we'll land in, but we're in the market for another breed.

0:38:39 - Cal
Well, to be honest, I really like using an English breed as the base of your maternal herd. And I say that, and actually when we talk about my dad's herd, it's a limousine-based herd that we've introduced some other breeds in to bring down some size. We'd already worked on docility, because that's so important, and some other things to do there. And then for my own herd I have some I guess you could call South Pole kind of English based, because Hereford and Angus were used in its development, and then, if you go back further, I think you could lump it in there. But then I have some Corrientes and those would not be considered English.

0:39:20 - Ashlynn
No.

0:39:20 - Cal
So but I do like that English base for your herd and crossing them with a cotton nino or exotic breed, and Solaire would be fairly unrelated to that, so that would be a really good cross, I think in my mind.

0:39:37 - Ashlynn
I'm going to tell him. You said that, outside my lack of, familiarity of it. Nope, I'm going to tell my husband. You said that, so I can use it to my benefit. Oh, okay.

0:39:44 - Cal
There you go, and I'm always partial to the to red breeds too, so that's always where I fall in that. And Solaire's naturally red, that deep mahogany, that pretty red, cross over a dam and then, going down the highway, someone there has I don't know 20 head, a really deep red cattle deeper red than red Angus typically are in this area. They remind me a red pole. There's some other breeds of possibility. Someone's outside. One day I will be stopping to find out what they're doing there because they just look a little bit different and find out.

And the other part is that my wife can't be with me. She does not let me pull into strange driveways. She's with me. She's like you're not stopping and talking to them.

0:40:34 - Ashlynn
Well, they're outside, I'm sure they're friendly, it's fine.

0:40:39 - Cal
Yeah, I'm sure. Yeah, which goes against the introvert. I was talking about that kind of stuff. I'm apt to do so, who knows? So, as you think about other breeds, have you thought about and we can cut this out have you thought about other species? Or are you content with the cattle and sticking with cattle?

0:41:02 - Ashlynn
We are sticking with cattle, for sure. I'll be honest, though, like if, when, I should say when we start having kids. Hopefully, I wouldn't be against if my kids wanted to show sheep or goats, but those creatures are just different in how you feed them, how you grow them, how you breed them. And I like my cows. I will stick with my cows.

0:41:26 - Cal
Well, there you go. That's a whole different story. Small ruminants yes. Yeah, ashlyn, it is time that we transition to our overgrazing section, sponsored by Redmond.

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0:42:56 - Ashlynn
I started really for a personal benefit. I hate to say it that way, but I just wanted to show what we were doing to hopefully encourage somebody else to try when I was in high school so I can sound old, but when I was in high school, instagram became a thing and I remember posting just a picture of my show heifer, or my bulls of the year, or my show steer, whatever it was, and it would just blow up because people love looking at cattle and they would want to ask questions. Oh yeah, it was a time period I really enjoyed. Well, as I got older, I stepped away from it, but now, with where social media is at, we're a lot more at a video-based type of content, not photos, and I'll be honest, that scared me.

I was like I can't make a video, I will look like an idiot, I can't edit, like no way, no, how. But I went to a marketing conference, like I've mentioned, and that conference was two part and the first part they just showed us, like the basics of using social media to share your story and as I sat there I'm like I can do that. I know my story, I know better than anyone else. Right, it was a task afterwards to a month between the two sessions, to actually start posting. Just try, and I did and, surprisingly, it took off.

And I realized how much I enjoyed having those conversations and responding to comments about what we were doing and the number of people that would come up to me that I see your videos, I love them, or, oh, I wait every day for you to post. I'm like, if anything, I'm at least making people smile. There's older generations. I'd be like you remind me so much of what it was like for us on the farm growing up and like I just love seeing everything you're doing. So, yeah, I started sharing on social media just as like a personal thing, but now I do it to really, like I said, encourage others and help other people just realize what being in agriculture and show like it's not always gonna be perfect, but as long as you're putting effort forth, that's what counts not always going to be perfect, but as long as you're putting effort forth, that's what counts and I think that's so important.

0:45:11 - Cal
And you mentioned there early on personal benefit. I started a podcast for my personal benefit podcast. People would talk to me that if I just called them on the phone and says, hey, I got some questions, they may have been a little more apprehensive about it. But when I say, hey, I've got a podcast, they're like sure I'll come on and talk to you. So it's worked really great and I get tons of benefit from it and I just happen to share it with my closest friends. So it's been really beneficial. But I started the podcast from the same purpose personal benefit and then I thought might as well be sharing these and I think it's so important we get ag out there so people can see it. I think when you're post on TikTok I've seen you've talked about the percentage of people in ag and the percentage of people not in ag and it's important we share our story so they see. So there's some connection there, yeah.

0:46:02 - Ashlynn
So there's some connection there. Yeah, bingo, connection is the key term. It is. What any advocate really is striving for is helping the consumer, helping the person that's not there with you see how, a it either relates to them or, b how they can see themselves in that situation, selves in that situation, because in all reality, there is less than 2% of America's entire population in production agriculture, meaning the people growing their food every day. 2% is not a majority. That is not going to swing votes.

That's not going to be the main narrative being shared. So we have to be encouraging people and building a team for production agriculture with those who aren't in ag to help share our story and support us and honestly protect the livelihood of agriculture and make sure, as farmers and rangers, we still can live out our passions and our family legacies and do it in the best way possible for everyone involved.

0:47:06 - Cal
Oh, yes, yeah, If someone's out there listening and they're thinking maybe I should boy that S was tough. Someone out there listening? Yeah, I know S's get me sometimes. Someone's out there listening and they're thinking oh, maybe I should share my ag story. How would you suggest they get started?

0:47:27 - Ashlynn
So if you are wanting to start, I would recommend pick one social media platform. There are, as we know, multiple out there, but when it comes down, you just need to pick one that you feel the most comfortable with. Learn that platform that you feel the most comfortable with. Learn that platform. Learn the best time to post. Learn what type of post your people like. Learn what is the difference between a video, a like, a comment share. Learn all that, because they all have different terminology with it.

And then, once you become really good at one platform and you've built your audience there, then go to the next one. Really get out one platform and you've built your audience there, then go to the next one. And same thing. Just pick one that you feel comfortable with, one that you understand, and just keep going. At the end of the day, you don't have to be on every single platform. It should not. I know we live in a world where people want to be the greatest thing and have all this attention and celebrity and be trendy. Yes, that's important, but I'll be honest, I've had a couple of videos go trendy. Holy moly, there are more mean people out there than I thought. And at the end of the day I'm like that's not really my audience.

That is not who I'm trying to speak to. So there's no point in me worrying about someone who isn't going to actually engage with my content. So that's no point in me worrying about someone who isn't going to actually engage with my content. So that's where we're going back Learning your platform, learning what your audience wants and just sticking with that. Don't worry about being trendy. Stick with what your audience wants, because those are the people that will defend you at the end of the day and stand for your livelihood with you.

0:49:01 - Cal
Oh yes. So if someone's starting this, how do they learn what their audience likes when they should post?

0:49:09 - Ashlynn
So there's a lot of different ways you can do it. I was very basic and I would just hop on Google and be like when's the best time to post on Facebook or when's the best time to post on Instagram? And there's people out there that have done research for years and can tell you the correct times and whatnot. And I just started from there and if it showed, okay, yeah, a lot of my people. So I'll be honest, I had a my trends going ups and downs and there was a while in there where 8am was my post time, like on the dot, I swear it was all the high school students checking their phones and all the adults checking their phones when they got to work. But, yeah, 8 am was my time and then it shifted and all of a sudden went to 1 pm and then it went to 4 pm.

So it just was an ebb and flow, and I learned that just by posting and seeing what type of reactions I would get, what type of reactions I would get.

As for content, I luck out and I have a very strong following on Facebook already from my family and friends and they've told me they like my ag stuff and that's become my personality is just people know me as the ag girl. Like I talk about cows, I love my cows, I have my dog, I have chickens. I was an ag teacher. I have to say it's important, like that was just who I was. So I would say for anyone that's trying to figure out what their content should be, take a minute and just look at, like, what does your personality say about you? Are you someone that rides horses a lot? Are you someone that shows livestock? Are you somebody that works for a local mechanic? Like that's a personality and just start sharing bits and pieces of that.

It doesn't have to be a video. You could post a picture or, honestly, stories. Stories are a huge area that people miss out on. Not everyone wants to have to scroll through how many pages and links. They just want to tap on the stories and go right through. Just start with your story.

0:51:00 - Cal
Oh yeah.

0:51:00 - Ashlynn
Find something that works for you and works for your audience and go with it.

0:51:05 - Cal
Very good. One thing I pick out from there lean into whatever you're doing. Just lean into it and use that. Don't try and figure out something else to add to what you're doing. Just lean in Exactly. Well, Ashlyn, it is almost time for us to do the famous four. But before we get there, do you have anything you'd like to share that maybe I didn't cover or you thought I might, and you're like, hey, I'd like to share this. Is there something you'd like to add?

0:51:36 - Ashlynn
Honestly, I'll say your questions are phenomenal. I feel like we covered everything that I feel like I know really well and fits the podcast. So I'm going to say no, you did a very good job. Well, well, thank you. It's nice to hear that hey say no, you did a very good job well, well, thank you.

0:51:49 - Cal
It's nice to hear that. Hey, maybe I did a better job.

0:51:52 - Ashlynn
I think you did fantastic, gold star well, thank you well, ashlyn.

0:51:59 - Cal
It is time for us to transition to our famous four questions. And yes, I know I say transition every time, and when I record an episode I'm always like I gotta learn a new word there, and then when I go to do the next episode, it's transition again.

0:52:12 - Ashlynn
It's a habit, it's time to transition.

0:52:14 - Cal
It is. It is because it's just almost on autopilot. When I hit, oh it's this point, I just it just comes out, Just rolls out as we transition to the famous four questions sponsored by Ken Cove Farm Fence. Ken famous four questions sponsored by Ken Cove Farm Fence. Ken Cove Farm Fence is a proud supporter of the Grazing Grass Podcast and grazers everywhere At Ken Cove Farm Fence they believe there's true value within the community of grazers and land stewards.

The results that follow proper management and monitoring can change the very world around us. That's why Ken Cove is dedicated to providing an ever-expanding line of grazing products to make your chores easier and your land more abundant. Whether you're growing your own food on the homestead or grazing on thousands of acres, Ken Cove has everything you need to do it well, From reels to tumblewills, polytwine to electric nets, water valves to water troughs, you'll find what you're looking for at Ken Cove. They carry brands like Speedrite, O'Briens, KiwiTec, Strainrite, Jobe and more. Ken Cove is proud to be part of your regenerative journey. Call them today or visit KenCovecom. And be sure to follow them on social media and subscribe to the Ken Cove YouTube channel at Ken Cove Farm Fans for helpful how-to videos and new product releases. There's same four questions we ask of all of our guests. Our first question, Ashley, what is your favorite grazing grass related book or resource?

0:53:46 - Ashlynn
So my favorite resource would honestly be our extension and outreach. I am not a reader, which is terrible to say because I was a teacher. But I'm not a reader. I enjoy, like conversation or watching video. So I would say an extension has a lot of stuff that we bounce ideas off of and then, honestly, I use people in my network. I found out there's more people that are doing or trying to do, grazing and just having conversation with what works for them, what doesn't, has helped me a ton. I'll be honest.

I'll speak on my husband's half. If he had a pick, it would either be his grazing management book from Iowa state or Tik TOK. That is where he goes for a lot. That's a good balance between us. We use a lot.

0:54:33 - Cal
Yeah.

0:54:35 - Ashlynn
There's not like one main book or anything I would give out. It's really just finding that group. For us, that group is Iowa state extension and then our cattle friends. Oh yeah, I'm free. I will use myself as a resource if someone needs it. If you want, you can use me as someone in your network.

0:54:55 - Cal
Wonderful. Our second question what is your favorite tool for the farm?

0:55:02 - Ashlynn
My favorite tool would probably be I thought on this one really hard because there's a lot. I love our bat wing because when we can't get to our paddocks, it helps keep them in the best vegetative state as possible. But I also love our utv. Yes, I love our utv because it is a truck. It can haul fence posts.

It helps us move cattle. It hauls feed. I don't know what we would do without it. So I don't know, maybe a toss up between one of those two, or even just our fence structure we have now because it helps us move the cows. So, yeah, there's not one main one. I'm very grateful for a lot of the tools we have.

0:55:52 - Cal
I've mentioned this on the podcast before. When I was working out the structure for the podcast, I knew I wanted to end with where people can find out more about you and I knew I wanted a question in there about resources and I knew I wanted an advice question. So that's one coming up. But then that last question I was trying to figure out. I wasn't even sure what I should ask and I landed up on what's your favorite tool and when I first started I was like I just don't know about this. It's actually one of my favorite questions now. I enjoy them all, but I love the answers, because they're so varied and different points of view and I get answers I'm not anticipating. Sometimes I anticipate them, but I always look forward to what's a person's favorite tool for the farm.

0:56:46 - Ashlynn
If you could be a part of a cheeseburger, what would you be Question?

0:56:49 - Cal
You don't know what's going to happen. Yeah, right, yeah, exactly. Our third question, ashlyn. What would you tell someone just getting started?

0:56:59 - Ashlynn
I would tell someone just getting started to don't doubt yourself. Don't get in that analysis paralysis. Just try. The fact that you care enough to think about the decision you're making is what matters. If you do the wrong thing, so what you can bounce back, It'll be okay. You just have to try and if you really are stuck, reach out, ask for help. In the ag world that's something I've learned is we are very much a family and we want other people to succeed. There are very few individuals that will turn you down because they don't want you to succeed and if you find one of those people, cut them from your circle. They're not meant to be there. There's too many other people that want you to succeed and help you. So, yeah, just keep trying. And again, if you get stuck, push forward. Find someone to help you and just don't stop. We need people in agriculture. Do not stop trying. We need you here.

0:57:57 - Cal
Excellent advice, I think the two things try it, get started. And then the community is so supportive, so helpful to other people, or at least that's what I found as well. So, yeah, reach out. And lastly, ashlyn, where can others find out more about you?

0:58:15 - Ashlynn
You can find me on three main social media platforms. You can find me on Facebook, Instagram or TikTok. All of them are the same name. I'm under Ashlyn Lingle Jones. Feel free to follow me, message whatever you like. I am here just to help. I want to answer questions. I want to help you find your ag story. I want you to find your place in ag. So, honestly, I had somebody reach out earlier this year asking if I knew anyone that needed summer help, because they want to get more experience on the farm and I gave them a list of friends I had in the area.

So, whatever you need, find me on one of those platforms. I'm more than happy to help you, and if I can't, I probably know someone that will.

0:58:57 - Cal
Oh, there you go, Ashlyn. We really appreciate you coming on and sharing with us today. Really enjoyed the conversation.

0:59:04 - Ashlynn
Thank you. I really enjoyed my time and I can't wait to hopefully have more conversations.

0:59:08 - Cal
Wonderful, I really hope you time and I can't wait to hopefully have more conversations Wonderful. I really hope you enjoyed today's conversation. I know I did. Thank you for listening and if you found something useful, please share it. Share it on your social media. Tell your friends, get the word out about the podcast. Helps us grow.

If you happen to be a grass farmer and you'd like to share about your journey, go to grazinggrasscom and click on Be Our Guest. Fill out the form and I'll be in touch. We appreciate your support by sharing our episodes and telling your friends about it. You can also support our show by buying our merch. We get a little bit back from that. Another way to support the show is by becoming a Grazing Grass Insider. Grazing Grass Insiders enjoy bonus content, monthly Zooms and discounts. You can visit the website grazinggrasscom, click on support and they'll have the links there. Also, if you haven't left us a review, please do. It really helps us, as people are searching for podcasts and I was just checking them and we do not have very many reviews for 2024. So if you haven't left us a review, please do. Until next time, keep on grazing grass.

Transcribed by https://podium.page